The Holonet Boards   » TPM & Original Trilogy   » Lightsaber tecniques


Xam Ngboohan

posted 06-17-2003 07:42 AM    
After watching Ep1 and the original trilogy for a few times I begin to realise a few things.

Obiwan in Ep1. His lightsaber tecnique was cool with lots of spinning and moving in a neat flow. However I come to realise that Obi-wan is just a little bit showoff. Take that scene which Qui and Obi jump from a bridge to another while fighting Maul. Obi just HAD to do the flip. Also in the hanger bay Obi just HAD to spin his saber only to be blocked and then kicked in the face. He could have just slashed normally and maybe land a blow.

Also in Ep4, Obi tries to do another spinning move on Vader. Go watch that and tell me how funny it looks.



LumbiaSith

posted 06-17-2003 05:27 PM    
Maybe its the techinque he learned during his earlier Padawan years from Quin Jon Jin or it might have been the fact that it was just an expression of part of his personality. That he was very self-confident, but not to the point that he didn't take the views of other into recognizition or disturb him.

It was probably arrogance in the part of fighting. A little bit of Young Padawan was still in him during those times. Like Yoda said, most Padawan are very arrogant and overly confident in there ability.



Xam Ngboohan

posted 06-17-2003 08:22 PM    
Yea I know but watch the part in Ep4 where Vader is holding his lightsaber in Obi's face and Obi tries to smack it away.

Its like,"woa don't touch me with that thing, I bruise like a grape".

Anyway another thing i noticed is Luke's tecnique. Sure its shabby, no flow, no stlye whatsoever. But on a positive side, it is unpredictable. One time Luke can be just parrying the blows he gets, the next time he can come back with aggressive slashes(Ep6).

And people still critisize Luke's saber skills.



LumbiaSith

posted 06-17-2003 10:52 PM    
Well mainly because Luke didnn't learn his lightsaber skills directly from anybody. It mainly came from expirence. So he let his emotions be the tool for his lightsaber ability.

Making his movements less fluent, and visually canny--but extremely aggresive but polished over with times of defense and quick stabs.

The reason it isn't as visually canny, fluent and flows greatily is because he was the only Jedi. He had Yoda teach him the ways of the force while Obi-Wan barley had to chance to teach him the arts of the lightsaber.

Skywalker never had that teaching like the rest of the Old Republic Jedi did.



Dash Kelderon

posted 06-19-2003 05:37 AM    
You make a good point Lumbia. But Luke's technique while solely guided by the force, be it light or dark, did manage to slip past the defenses of the strongest Jedi ever to fly around the universe. At least twice!

So as un-asthetically pleaseing as it may be, it works. Plain and simple. It works!



Xam Ngboohan

posted 06-19-2003 07:49 AM    
Actually there is only one reason for Luke being able to fend off Vader.

Vader's armour restricts his movement. He cannot use the Lightsaber to his full potential. Also Vader gave Luke "mercy" in Ep5. He wanted Luke to join him and embrace the dark side.



LumbiaSith

posted 06-19-2003 01:39 PM    
But in Episode 6, Return of the Jedi, Luke was whippin' his butt. I remember the scene where he began cutting reletnlessly at the Vader on the ground.

Though he was submitting to the Dark side in his attacks of aggresion, it was for the better good of everyone else. So it's hard to say exactly what he was truly doing with that attack. He may have been submitting to the Dark Side of aggresion for the better of the universe.

It was cool how he just cut off his arm..



Xam Ngboohan

posted 06-19-2003 05:27 PM    
Vader was caught by surprise. His armour made him too slow to assume the proper defense position against Luke.

LumbiaSith

posted 06-19-2003 06:19 PM    
What are you getting at. Luke still has a good style of fighting, especially for his time.

It was effective and he techinically won what he came there for.



Xam Ngboohan

posted 06-19-2003 08:10 PM    
I am saying that it is not Luke that is good. It is Vader that is shabby(that silly suit of his)

LumbiaSith

posted 06-19-2003 08:23 PM    
Well what do you expect, no other Jedi would be any better, probably worst he got the same amount of training in the same time.

No one is naturally born with lightsaber skills, this guy had to learn mainly by his own expirences. He still manages to get the job done on numerous occasions. It isn't stylish, doesn't have to be. It was more of a lance style to me. Poke a few times and quickly attack another.

He had a nice lightsaber techinque if you ask me, he could deal a few scares to Obi-Wan.

Also, in the time it was more of short stabs instead of quick twirls, because the blaster ruled the galaxy with an iron fist, not a lightsaber. It was seen as an old ancient toy.

That is mainly why back in the earlier days of the Republic, during the Sith War, the blaster wasn't seen as great as a lightsaber in trained hands.

In that time of Luke's existence there was more blaster battles than lightsaber ones. Of course his father is superior, he was trained in both arts.

The whole existence of the Jedi was thought to be whipped out, for the exception of Darth Vader. When it did exist, it was still a possibility to learn the stylish fashion of the older times aswel as the offensive and defensive style of the newer times.



Xam Ngboohan

posted 06-19-2003 08:29 PM    
Quick stabs.....yea I know what you r talking about. However I prefer style, grace and great looking lightsaber fights to those "get to the point" saber fights.

LumbiaSith

posted 06-19-2003 08:39 PM    
Yah, he's more stiff. Might be age,

Dash Kelderon

posted 06-20-2003 04:36 AM    
I don't know... As long as you can recover for a block after every cut or slash, I think the technique is irrelevant.

If you can't get hit, you can't lose right?!?



MindMaster

posted 06-21-2003 02:46 PM    
It all depends on the lightsaber form. As you probably know, there are many different styles of fighting with a lightsaber:

Form 1 is simple blocking and swinging techniques.

Form 2 is incredibly graceful fighting, with large swings and broad body movements, like a dance. Count Dooku studied it.

Form 3 is the standard Jedi form, created for combat with blasters. Equal balence between attack and defence. Obi-Wan studied it.

Form 4 was a very difficult form, focused mainly on defnsive technique, wearing the opponent down with his own energy. Yoda studied it.

Form 5 was a failure made up by a band of Jedi Masters obsessed with fancy tricks.

Form 6 was the form raw power and attacking ability. Could catch the opponent off guard. Anakin studied it.

Form 7 was a mix of all the other forms. Intensely difficult and powerful. Mace Windu studied it.

Luke probably didn't have the time to learn all these forms thuroughly. He kind of improvised. It still proved to be very effective.

[ 06-21-2003 02:47 PM: Message edited 1 time, lastly by MindMaster ]



LumbiaSith

posted 06-21-2003 04:29 PM    
Yah, I agree completely. That is what I was thinking when I posted earlier about how he didn't have anything to base his techinques off.

MindMaster

posted 06-21-2003 07:17 PM    
I'll bet he learned a bit of Form 3 from Obi, and some Form 4 from Yoda, but not enough, and he just had to peice that together with his own skills.

LumbiaSith

posted 06-21-2003 10:58 PM    
I don't think Yoda taught him anything of Form 4, or of anything to deal with lightsaber skills. I think in truth that the techinques he used in the movie against Darth Vader were mainly made up off the little amount of training he got from Obi-Wan in the arts of defense and the years that seperated Episode 4 and Episode 5.

Yoda taught him mostly in the arts of the Force, not that of the lightsaber. That what was necessary at the time. To be able to use the Force to guide him in his path, aswell as use it as an ally in confrontation with evil or troubles.

That is what Yoda taught him....

No lightsaber techinques.



Dash Kelderon

posted 06-22-2003 06:07 AM    
Luke fought purely on instinct. Which I belevie is the heart and soul of the JEDI.

I would have to say that although the technique may not look pretty, but if it comes from instinct, there really is no way to beat it. That's why Luke wins so many battles. He doesn't focus his mind on following a routine. He just fights.

That's how I would do it!



Entaris

posted 06-22-2003 05:21 PM    
Now now now... Im into the whole "discuss SW as though it made sense" deal too...

But the reason in this one just cant be argued with...

In the original trilliagy, there special affects sucked ass compared to now... They were still dealign with second rate lightsaber affects...

The combat had to be slow, if they did it fast the computer wouldnt have been able to keep up to add the glow...

Ep1 was filled with all the flips and spins to showcase the brand spankin new special affects they had at there disposal...

If they were to remake the original trilliagy...again...(that is, if it were humanly possible for the actors to actauly do it) They would probably add in the cool flips, and spins.

Now getting down to the first post... As for the flip, the starwarsian theory(aka a reason aside from "they are showing off new Special effects) Now that would be because, it actauly adds jumping power... You see, when he flipsit brings his feet up with the lift, so he can land more easily, not trying to aim his still outstretched legs...

Also flips help increase the movement, making you NOT a big target that say's "please kill me now"

As for the spinning of the lightsabers, thats the same reason maul had a dual blade... Just to showcase there awsome ness...



LumbiaSith

posted 06-22-2003 10:18 PM    
Also, people were stiff back in the day.

Entaris

posted 06-22-2003 11:02 PM    
ya.. .They could remake the original trillagy... rather then lightsabers... they could have "energy canes" and fight like that :P chase eachother shakign there fists... hell ya...

LumbiaSith

posted 06-22-2003 11:04 PM    
Hahah, I've seen the actor who played Luke lately, he's old. No way he'd be able to make a remake, he might die of a heart attack doing one of the moves. He looked kinda old then, maybe he was smoking....

Hmmm...



Dash Kelderon

posted 06-23-2003 04:01 AM    
Actually Mark Hamill did a cameo in JAY AND SILENT BOB STRIKE BACK.

If you had seen the movie you will understand this. His character is named Cocknocker. He has one really large fist, and weilds a "Vibrosaber". Now JAY and SILENT BOB have "BONGsabers" And they reinact a Lightsaber duel. Mark Hamill does pretty well with this role touting off lines like "Don't F__K with the Jedi master son!" and "No little punk is gonna upstage me!"

After watching this, I do feel that he could do it. But how are you gonna get a replacement for Sir Alec Guiness(Obi-Wan Kenobi)???



LumbiaSith

posted 07-04-2003 05:33 AM    
Why would you, make up could make the guy playing Obi-Wan looking older than he is.

Edit: Also, I say Jay and Silent Bob, hehe--didn't know it was him.

[ 07-04-2003 05:33 AM: Message edited 1 time, lastly by LumbiaSith ]



Dash Kelderon

posted 07-04-2003 08:12 AM    
Lumbia... IT flashed right on the screen. "Hey Kids! It's Mark Hamill!"

How did you miss that?



LumbiaSith

posted 07-04-2003 02:32 PM    
Mainly because I don't remember many people by who they are, just "That guy that played Luke" or something of that sort.

Dash Kelderon

posted 07-05-2003 03:26 AM    
Well, I "high"ly reccomend that you watch the movie again! Bluntman and Cronic RULE!!!!